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 Current Rules Encourage a Sonny Liston Dive in 2nd half

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PostSubject: Current Rules Encourage a Sonny Liston Dive in 2nd half    Wed Jan 22, 2014 4:49 pm

Now we reward teams for tanking it during the last third of the season, so contenders who are playing those teams at that time of the year will gain an advantage against the other contenders. Using FAAB bids for Free Agents and waiver Claims will eliminate some of it, but that early first round bid farm pick is a powerful incentive not to set your best lineup when you know you can no longer make the playoffs. We could for instance do serpentine rounds and the order in the first round should be the highest teams in the 2nd division (those who donít make the playoffs) draft first to the worst in the 2nd div, then reverse order of final playoff teamís standings for the odd rounds. Also the teams can change so much from the end of the season till the next, though priority is based on their finish the last season, even though it may now be a whole new ball game in June or July. Keep waiver claims priority for the first one that takes place before the MLB Season Opener as previous seasonís reverse standings round by round. All the ones after the first week give the 2nd division teams a single buck each week to spend later. If we start with $100 they could gain a 20% advantage, but they have to be active during the current season to get it. Active is good. Theyíve got to spend those bonus dollars in the daily transactions.
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PostSubject: Re: Current Rules Encourage a Sonny Liston Dive in 2nd half    Thu Jan 23, 2014 4:24 pm

While I like the idea of incentivizing fight to the finish, and think disinterest (I don't think it's actual tanking to be honest) is a major problem, I don't think this will solve it. Attrition tends to happen from the bottom, so this will likely have minimal impact. It will also add to further discouragement as the draft is really the primary tool to significantly improve (even if that means trading).

Also, when attracting new owners to a down trodden team, it's a lot easier to say - Hey!! You've got the first pick then - sorry the team is in disarray, try for 10th place next year with your crappy team and maybe you'll get closer to the top of the draft.

There are like 15 suggestions in your 1 paragraph - I am only responding to the draft changes you suggest.
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PostSubject: Re: Current Rules Encourage a Sonny Liston Dive in 2nd half    Thu Jan 23, 2014 8:42 pm

I think we played around with this as well before, about having incentives to finish higher in the rankings, but none of the options really solve the problem.

1. Going with a serpentine draft, goes against the idea of helping out the bottom teams, and in many ways just rewards the teams that are mediocre and tank their way closer to the bottom, but not at the bottom.

2. Going with a separate playoff seemed like a logical idea at first, but then it runs into scheduling problems. Essentially, ALL the teams that didn't make the playoffs, would be placed in the playoffs for a chance to win some money ($50?). But considering, 14 teams don't make the playoffs, the scheduling aspect doesn't match the amount of weeks left in the season at that point. And if we include the bottom 6, then the tanking to get into the bottom 6 is exactly the same as tanking for the draft so it just shifts the problem from one to another.

3. Going with a monetary penalty based system (where your league fee is up say $10 if you can't compete) also wouldn't work since then we're not helping struggling teams have a chance at recovery and more chance that people are going to leave if their team is horrible and don't want to pay extra.



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PostSubject: Re: Current Rules Encourage a Sonny Liston Dive in 2nd half    Fri Feb 07, 2014 11:17 pm

Agree with Jammy and Al here. It's not a perfect system, but it's how things go. I don't believe it's really tanking either so much as a loss of interest. Now if we blatantly see that Team A in 2nd to last place has 3 injured players in his lineup and 3 healthy ones on bench then a commish needs to make the change. That's where the league members come in though. Come and talk to us if you feel like someone is throwing a week. We'll look into it.

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PostSubject: Re: Current Rules Encourage a Sonny Liston Dive in 2nd half    Sat Feb 08, 2014 3:09 pm

Detecting a theme here - top teams suggesting they understand how to motivate bottom teams. I have never tanked and try to win how I can. Sure there is little incentive, but I'm here to try to get better and like how I've started to rebuild with prospects.

Small changes are what leagues like this need. Start with Waivers and FA fixes.
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PostSubject: Re: Current Rules Encourage a Sonny Liston Dive in 2nd half    Sat Feb 08, 2014 4:54 pm

thenuner wrote:
Detecting a theme here - top teams suggesting they understand how to motivate bottom teams. †I have never tanked and try to win how I can. †Sure there is little incentive, but I'm here to try to get better and like how I've started to rebuild with prospects.

Small changes are what leagues like this need. Start with Waivers and FA fixes.

I won a championship and then gutted my squad and rebuilt it from the ground up with prospects. So don't say I'm just another top team "trying" to understand how to motivate bottom teams. I don't believe tanking is any sort of an issue. You're a prime example of this. Your team isn't good but you've been slowly adding pieces to get there. Just because someone makes a trade you wouldn't, you take it personal. Like someone kicked your puppy. In my opinion you should trade Beltran for the best package the market will give you... Not what you believe he's worth... Before he rots and hangs up his cleats and have nothing to show for him. Now, that's my opinion. I'm up for whatever is best for the league. Babying other owners because you don't agree with trades just stupid. Because just like my opinion I gave you, everyone's is different. You run your squad how you see fit, while everyone else does the same.
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PostSubject: Re: Current Rules Encourage a Sonny Liston Dive in 2nd half    Sun Feb 09, 2014 1:23 am

Well in the end, it's upto the owners themselves to make decisions and get players. There are only a finite number of good players out there, and that number is exceeded by the number of slots we have, so no matter how prepared everyone is, some people are just going to get stuck with bad players. It's bad luck. It takes time to rebuild, and it's risky as well. Almost all rebuilding projects go through prospects and they can be pretty unpredictable.

While I've been pretty lucky in this league, there have been plenty of leagues where I've struggled at the onset (especially the basketball league I did with some of the folks from here) where I essentially donated money for the first 3 years before turning it around, so I think pretty much everyone knows how it feels to be a bottom feeder team as well at some point, may it be here or some other league.

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PostSubject: Re: Current Rules Encourage a Sonny Liston Dive in 2nd half    Fri Feb 28, 2014 1:04 am

Did we buy the lifetime league last year like we talked about? If so I have a suggestion that was kind of hit on earlier in a round about way. How about instead of upping the winnings for the playoff teams we pay down to the second to last team even if it is a couple dollars up to give intensive to not finish last.

The idea of making the last few place teams pay more is not right unless we can prove they are tanking. A team could have bad luck with injuries in a year and end up in last place cause they have to use the scraps that are on the FA market. That would not be fair to charge them extra if they were trying to do well.
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PostSubject: Re: Current Rules Encourage a Sonny Liston Dive in 2nd half    Fri Feb 28, 2014 2:05 am

Yes, I did buy the Fantrax lifetime membership for the league.
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